Quantized notes sound un-quantized

[paulkeeley]

aaaaaaand since i clearly haven't posted enough today on this topic, i've made a bit of a breakthrough.

in VC mode, everything is rock solid. it's only in MIDI standalone mode where the timing goes to hell and back. again, no problems with my other synths whatsoever using the same MIDI interface(s), cables, etc.

so, it must simply be the way the TI is handling MIDI input info. or at least that seems to be the case with mine.

hope this helps in any way, however insignificant.

cheers,
Paul.

[Totty]

Originally Posted by paulkeeley

aaaaaaand since i clearly haven't posted enough today on this topic, i've made a bit of a breakthrough.

in VC mode, everything is rock solid. it's only in MIDI standalone mode where the timing goes to hell and back. again, no problems with my other synths whatsoever using the same MIDI interface(s), cables, etc.

so, it must simply be the way the TI is handling MIDI input info. or at least that seems to be the case with mine.

hope this helps in any way, however insignificant.

cheers,
Paul.

Hi Paul, sounds like you have made a breakthrough I'm downloading your Logic file and will have a go here too. From what I know the VC timestamps midi events so the timing should be accurate on VC, However as you say, your other midi synths don't exhibit this problem.

I will also try a midi connection to my TI, may take me a few days as I'm set up very minimally at the moment, so I'll have to dust off my AMT8 and Motu in the attic

Best regards

Michael

[oblivion]

Very interesting thread!

I hope Access is reading this.

[Totty]

Yes it is! I'm conscious that there may be 2 separate issues are here.

1: The Midi Timing of the Virus TI as a standalone midi Synth.
2: The issue I mentioned regarding heavy patches and fast modulation/envelopes tripping up the sound.

I'm inclined to think they may be one of the same. I'm speculating here but if there are DSP resource issues as a standard midi synth this could be alleviated to an extent by loosening the sound reaction time so that lots of notes don't start exactly together. I know midi is a serial protocol and no 2 notes can sound exactly together, but by reducing reaction time would give the hardware more processing time (not good!).

With Virus Control the data has to appear out sample accurately apparently. This would disallow the theory above, but since I have experienced these modulation and envelope discrepancies, that could also be as a result of DSP resources lacking.

I'm happy to be proven wrong - in fact I hope I'm wrong, because as it stands I don't feel I can make a complex sound and have it play back correctly unless I'm using only one channel.

[paulkeeley]

hey all - once again, another development on my end. with the patch in question, running in MIDI standalone mode, i noticed that if i adjust the amplifier envelope release time to 20, where there is no note overlap, the timing is relatively tight. not as tight as VC mode, but much tighter than before. however when i bump it up to 36, where there is slight note overlap, the timing goes awry. yet another clue that it may be the way the virus is handling note information and note stealing.

i've sent this latest development to Access support. hopefully they can shed some light on the subject. if anyone has a chance to try the same out on their setup it would be greatly appreciated. if this isn't just an issue with my virus, then this is something hopefully Access can fix.

cheers,
Paul.

[oblivion]

Have you experienced any problem with ordinary patches = Bass, Trance sounds, strings and pads?

Hope there is only problem with complex patches.

[Totty]

Originally Posted by oblivion

Have you experienced any problem with ordinary patches = Bass, Trance sounds, strings and pads?

Hope there is only problem with complex patches.

Hi Oblivion,

It's really hard to quantify, the problem I suppose is originally you don't build things up thinking scientifically like we are now, and I'm sure no one here really does. I've never used the TI VC all out as I've had other issues over the years and have just used it for one or 2 channels. As I said in a previous post I've really cut down my hardware - it's all still here upstairs but with my MacPro and the TI and sometimes the Blofeld I feel I have it all covered and alot more space

But as I've come to use the VC more, these niggles have surfaced and I'm still avoiding using it like I would like to. From memory standard patches with none of the more complex forms of synthesis are far more efficient than the others. This is no secret and Access say that polyphony drops alot with graintables and formant processing. I don't mind that at all, but I want what I do play to be played back with rock solid timing and not with random glitches in modulation or envelopes if I choose a more complex synthesis method.

Hope this explains a little better.

[synthfiend]

As a matter of interest Paul, when you are using the Virus in VC mode are you using the Virus as your sound card or are you using the sound card on your PC ?

Out of all the different ways you can route audio and midi with the TI I am starting to suspect from what I read and have experienced that you get the best performance (latency wise etc) when using VC with the TI as your sound card. Maybe wrong though

[paulkeeley]

Originally Posted by synthfiend

As a matter of interest Paul, when you are using the Virus in VC mode are you using the Virus as your sound card or are you using the sound card on your PC ?

Out of all the different ways you can route audio and midi with the TI I am starting to suspect from what I read and have experienced that you get the best performance (latency wise etc) when using VC with the TI as your sound card. Maybe wrong though

i remember trying to use the TI as a soundcard when i first bought it (quite a while ago now) to see if it would solve the latency issue, but didn't notice any marked improvement over my existing audio interface. in fact if i recall correctly, i was getting worse latency when using the TI's audio. anyway, i pretty much dropped the idea then and there, since i have other external gear that i need to be able to record and much prefer to use my trusty FW410 for such things.

thanks for the suggestion though - definitely an option for those who are using their TI without any other external gear.

[oblivion]

Is it safe to use it with just five or six channels and ordinary subtractive synthesis+arpeggios and lots of fx?

I want it badly because of its soundquality, but if it is useless as a multitimbral synth with sloppy timing I have to find an other synth.

Just interested of its subtractive synthesis, fx and arpeggios, dont care about the other synthesis in the Virus TI.

I hope that you have the answer?

Thanks!