Virus TI, Komplete, Keyboard, Maschine

[IanT]

NI is having a sale. Essentially if you buy a keyboard or Maschine you get 50% off a crossgrade to Komplete 10 or Komplete 10 Ultimate:

http://www.native-instruments.com/en...ng-into-sound/

Very tempting. But haven't explored my TI yet

I'm more keyboard than pad, but never tried pads so I'm wondering if this is a good time to jump in.

So, some Qs....

Does anyone use the Virus as a controller for Komplete - or as a controller in general? How does it fare? Any idea how it compares to the NI S series?

It seems a shame to get (yet) another keyboard but the S series looks cool and seems to offer good control over Komplete in particular. And it has an Arp button which would be useful live. (Should I ever get that far.)

Anyone any experience of Maschine? Some reviews say to forget the Mikro and get the middle one (Groove). Again, it seems useful for live use but some people say it's a beatmaker rather than a DAW so I'm not sure how it would work live. My idea of 'live' would be to play some sort of pre-recorded tracks, maybe loop some sections (play till ready - can it do that?) and play beats and effects over the top.

Any thoughts or opinions would be welcome.

Ian
Yep, proper confused now...

[MBTC]

Originally Posted by IanT

Anyone any experience of Maschine? Some reviews say to forget the Mikro and get the middle one (Groove). Again, it seems useful for live use but some people say it's a beatmaker rather than a DAW so I'm not sure how it would work live. My idea of 'live' would be to play some sort of pre-recorded tracks, maybe loop some sections (play till ready - can it do that?) and play beats and effects over the top.

Berni and I both have Maschine and have written much about them here, probably want to use the search feature to forage around for those threads. I'd say its a lot more than just a beat maker, it is also a DAW, but I'm not sure how many people use it as a primary DAW. For me it is primarily a drum machine and sampler, but it is not limited to that use at all, you can create entire tracks with it... its a nice piece of equipment overall. I still have the original MKI model plus several expansions, no planned upgrade in sight as it still works as new, unless they release some software upgrade I need. I believe Berni has the most recent top of line model.

Be aware that NI has a tendency to run sales right before they come out with the latest and greatest whatever, just in case you're the type that's bothered by that.

Honestly if I were you and had just newly acquired a Virus and were just dipping my toes in the water of modern DAW etc. then I wouldn't feel compelled to buy more gear solely due it being on sale, otherwise you may find yourself overwhelmed with stuff to learn and no time to get to it all. Sometimes its better to acquire one thing at a time and get better acquainted with it. I feel that way about everything I have -- wish I knew it all inside out but there's never enough time. Unless maybe you're retired or something and are able to spend 8 hours a day messing with audio gear then maybe...

[IanT]

Ah, MBTC, your advice is far too sensible...

I'm not so bothered if they upgrade Komplete but I'd be a bit miffed if they released new hardware. But isn't Maschine II (relatively) new? Not sure about the keyboards.

Reading around the net, NI seem to have a couple of sales a year, don't they?

What's your view on Mikro vs Groove?

Do you use the Virus as a controller?

I'll have a dig about for your posts.

Time? In theory loads, in practise no...

[MBTC]

Not sure what Groove is but assuming its the medium size one, that is my preference and is the size of the MKI I have. Where it matters most is your tendancy to interact with the hardware itself vs the software... I like doing some things with hardware and other things with the large screen of a computer. If you prefer to stay off the computer and deal more with the hardware, the large one is nice with the extra screens and features. The advantage of Mikro is space saving if you need that. I have mine mounted on a Roland drum stand (love it). I believe the middle sized version is the only one you can do that with, the large and small need to go on a tabletop.

I don't have a Virus keyboard, I have a Snow and use a Novation 61 key controller. My guess is controlling Komplete with the Virus would be just like any other MIDI keyboard, someone else could answer more specifically maybe.

Maschine 2.0 is the software. For example I have generation 1 hardware but I upgraded the software to 2.0 for a fee. I believe all the current hardware is generation 2 except the large model is newer. I would not be surprised if they come out with a gen 3 version sometime soon or add to the product line. Maybe new software features -- anyone's guess really.

[IanT]

Yep, Groove is the medium one. I was taking the names from Amazon but I think NI just calls them Mikro, Maschine and Studio.

I've used old hardware sequencers and drum machines, synths, sound modules, samplers, and keyboards for recording but never used modern hardware for recording. All my recording has been via a keyboard and usual DAW editors and instruments.

So many people seem to think these pad things are the best music-making gear ever. When they first appeared, no offence intended, but I thought they appealed to people who couldn't read or play - music by numbers sort of thing - and I couldn't see the point.

However, trying to be open minded about it and these are still getting rave reviews from many people so I am tempted by NI's offer to give it a shot and get a good set of instruments into the bargain.

Having said all that, I think the S keyboard would be a better controller then the TI.

Oh, decisions, decisions...

[Berni]

Originally Posted by IanT

Yep, Groove is the medium one. I was taking the names from Amazon but I think NI just calls them Mikro, Maschine and Studio.

I've used old hardware sequencers and drum machines, synths, sound modules, samplers, and keyboards for recording but never used modern hardware for recording. All my recording has been via a keyboard and usual DAW editors and instruments.

So many people seem to think these pad things are the best music-making gear ever. When they first appeared, no offence intended, but I thought they appealed to people who couldn't read or play - music by numbers sort of thing - and I couldn't see the point.

However, trying to be open minded about it and these are still getting rave reviews from many people so I am tempted by NI's offer to give it a shot and get a good set of instruments into the bargain.

Having said all that, I think the S keyboard would be a better controller then the TI.

Oh, decisions, decisions...

Yeah I would forget all about using the virus for a controller. The new NI keyboards or Maschine are way better options if you are considering getting the komplete package because of the tight integration with the instruments. You can also use Maschine to control most DAW's, works great with Live.

[IanT]

Well that's made that clear! Been looking at vids and comments and the NI stuff seems to integrate with the software extremely well so I was coming to the conclusion that the Virus wasn't going to be a great option.

All I have to do is convince myself that a Maschine is a better option than a S keyboard... Or not...

[MBTC]

Originally Posted by IanT

Well that's made that clear! Been looking at vids and comments and the NI stuff seems to integrate with the software extremely well so I was coming to the conclusion that the Virus wasn't going to be a great option.

All I have to do is convince myself that a Maschine is a better option than a S keyboard... Or not...

As far as being solely a controller, I think Maschine vs. a keyboard is kind of like being at the home improvement store and trying to decide which is better, a hammer or a screwdriver? Different tools for different types of jobs.

I think Berni was saying the NI keyboard would be better for controlling Komplete because a lot of things would be automatically mapped, and consistent across NI plugins I think (although that's hard to imagine because the plugins themselves are not really consistent across the product line). One thing you might look into is the Novation line of controllers, because the Automap software gives you the ability to basically do same regardless of plugin vendor.

Back to hammer vs screwdriver... Maschine is good for percussion, or triggering things like Berni said automation clips in Live. It is not good for playing a piano solo for example, or things like playing chords based on traditional music theory. You can play chords but you're doing it the Maschine way, not the way music as an art has done it for hundreds of years.

I like it because of the tight throw of the pads for percussive sounds and samples, like the old akai samplers. For keyboard playing I like a piano layout and some weight and throw in the keys. If I could only have one I'd take the keyboard because I can always play drums on a keyboard but I can't play the piano on Maschine.

[IanT]

Originally Posted by MBTC

One thing you might look into is the Novation line of controllers, because the Automap software gives you the ability to basically do same regardless of plugin vendor.

Argh!!!!!!!!

They do look good and I was thinking of them for general control duties but the tight integration of all the NI stuff, I think, will win this one.

Anyway, I'm narrowing it down!

I'm going to pop into a local shop at the weekend and see how well - or badly! - I take to the pads and, hopefully, come to a decision! But this discussion has been extremely helpful in getting me this far and I greatly appreciate all your thoughts and input.

I'll let you know what happens....

[IanT]

Well, I went for the Maschine (middle one)...