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  #1  
Old 23.04.2005, 04:26 AM
BlakeLight BlakeLight is offline
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Default Is there anyone who actually PLAYS the Virus Keyboard Live?

Is there anyone who uses the Virus in some live context in which it is performed on (not sequenced) like a piano [ie, you play it like Vladimir Horowitz, Billy Joel or Billy Corgan would hit the piano/keyboard)?

I use it like a piano / guitar - get tones that blow my guitar out of the water - play chords like a keyboard (i.e. lots of suspensions and other awkward voicings that my guitar could never handle)... are there any other players out there like me? Id love to hear from ya. Late.

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Old 23.04.2005, 09:44 AM
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i think most of use are studio guys.
unfortunatly i was never offered to play live.
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  #3  
Old 23.04.2005, 10:04 PM
BlakeLight BlakeLight is offline
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ah, k.... just wondering... cause I'm really not much of a studio person per se, I prefer to improvise everything directly via my setup... I wouldnt mind using plugins and such... but I have yet to figure out a way to incorporate a live Virus KC through a LapTop that will be able to act as an effect while also being playable in a live situation, like performing a song.... I prefer to have complete control over everything Im doing, rather than sequencing it (save for triggering drum sequences)... it doesnt strike me like there are many of those types of players out there...

Cause I dont really use my Virus for techno or anything like that... I approach it like an electric guitarist does his instrument, except I use it like a massive tone generating machine... much more powerful than an electric guitar can ever be... I prefer to program goth bassy sounds that, when filtered right, turn into leads in the higher registers, but also have the clarity to be used as good rhythmic devices when layered with delays.

What instruments do you guys have performance chops on? Im a guitarist / pianist in training... but I love whack sounds... hence how I ended up coming to my beloved KC.
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Old 24.04.2005, 06:34 AM
Hollowcell Hollowcell is offline
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By "live" I thought you meant out in a gig situation.

I don't step sequence anything when I record my music. I play on the fly and record in that way - sometimes to audio, but mostly to midi first. Still though, I won't usually play a whole line right the way through the track - I'll play and few bars then copy and paste it. The only time I'll play a whole line is if I'm stuffing around doing an orchectral style number or something.

I never quantize beats, but playing the entire rythm section of a track would never work because there are just too many layers - resampling sections could get around this though.

My computer can't really run the latest plug-ins (celleron800) and I really just use it as a multi-track recorder. Step editing seems like a real chore for me on the computer - easier to play it in.

I think most people work in a similar way to me though. I can't imagine the time it would take to write every note into a sequencer.
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Old 25.04.2005, 12:37 AM
BlakeLight BlakeLight is offline
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I meant gigging... IE, playing all the musical lines on a set of keyboards like a Jazz organist on his setup (by sequencing I meant inputting melody lines into a recorder of sorts and having it playback, independently of human performance)

The closest example to what Im thinking of is John Medeski of Medeski, Martin, and Wood... but I don't care much for music that wanks around, I prefer songs with concise focus as opposed to "free-form jamming"... the type of stuff Ive been listening is rock like Coheed and Cambria, Muse, Radiohead, the Smashing Pumpkins, and a hefty dose of early NIN - the spirit of their music is the closest to what I do... I play everything live on my keyboard... I dont record it and ask it to play... its limiting insofar as you cant control everything at once, but having that control over a few keyboards in real time gives you an infinite amount of control to explore textures and improvise songs on the fly that I dont think Id ever find by writing indivualized lines. My performing setup, once completed, will be my Virus KC, a V-Synth, an MPC, perhaps a Nord or Waldorf, and my guitar through my guitar rig.

I like electronica sounds... thats why I got a Virus, nothing has a better ballsy tone than that thing. But Ive never heard any really good electronica pop songs... most strikes me as being random noises over a straight break beat or alot of boring harmonic material (I-IV-ii-V7-I or I-vii-vi-vii-I chord progressions) I certainly hope theres more... Ive heard stuff like Amon Tobin and thought it was interesting, but I also heard that his stuff was used in a video game (which I think demonstrates my sentiments over its emotional depth). I love the variety in electronica sounds, but the trouble to me is it all strikes me as music to pop E to, rather than to listen... and most IDM ive heard (like Squarepusher and stuff on Ninja Tune) makes me think of Medeski, Martin, and Wood... ie, limited structure, lots of improv that centers around a central motif without much expansion - the creativity lies more in the creation of the sounds textures rather than their manipulation into song structures that hit on a more expressive level.

I really do believe that there must be people who are doing great stuff with synths... and specifically with the Virus and VA's of that nature... but I have yet to hear anything with synths which knocks my socks off like Sgt. Peppers Lonely Hearts Club or Mellon Collie and the Infinite Sadness or OK Computer. (and yes, Ive listened to the whole gamut of whats considered classic electronica, from Kraftwerk onward - so I dont make these comments lightly). Perhaps thats why electronica hasnt gone mainstream in the United States, because techno isnt packaged into song format, or because noone has writen it into good pop songs (Im not talking of the Justin Timberlake ilk... I mean of the substative pop song variety that includes 'pop' groups like the Beatles and Nirvana) But please prove me wrong... Im infinitely open to new music... Id love to hear suggestions for listening for music that uses gear like the Virus that is song... not jam... oriented. Peace.

-Blakelight
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  #6  
Old 25.04.2005, 11:52 AM
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just something you got me wonder about,
clasical music has taken more then 200 years to evolve to what we hear today,i think new methods of music are being created but are still at early stages of development...
synth music exsist only 40 something years...

what do you think about this?
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Old 25.04.2005, 04:49 PM
BlakeLight BlakeLight is offline
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In response to your question Tomer... I think we're sitting on the cusp of ALOT of HUGE changes in the way we look at and address the creation and performance of music. Classical Music, in the sense of the modern orchestra has been around for 200 years (since the development of the instruments stabilized, but there has been alot of great 'art' music before then.) One need only listen to Bach (who was circa 1700) to hear the beginnings of modern musical ideas... hes really the first guy to have developed musical ideas into larger architectures... like his A minor Prelude and Fugue for the Organ... theres a larger drama to it... but then again, Bach was a figure who was part of a greater consolidation in music, all the instruments he used were pretty much well established, violins havent changed much since then.

Now though, I think we have a completely different dilemma, we have instruments that are PERPETUALLY changing... just look at the variety of synth architectures out there, from different takes on beat-slicing to subractive and additive synthesis, theyre all a slant on electronic music production of sounds at their most basic level, tones and overtones and formants and whatever scientific ways we happen to create in order to understand that mysterious thing known as sound. I think you raise a valid point, the whole development of the instrument is in a very embrioyonic stage... its just hatching really in my opinion. *by the way, these are things I think about alot... especially concerning instrument design and how to implement changes in extra-musical structures (such as a concrete thing as an instrument... or a more amorphous thing... musical notation.)

As far as the synth is concerned, I think that you can get sounds... the likes of which noone has ever thought possible before... we are not dealing with C major chords anymore... we're dealing with the pure production of tone (all this is just an outgrowth of Wagner's Tristan Chord in my opinion) and we are faced with the dilemma of how do we organize our instincts... because I think in terms which dont work when translated straight into my guitar / piano playing (Im classically trained on both, though I dont really care to play much Beethoven or Carcassi, as much as I might love them - Im more of a NIN man) and thus... when I think in a weirdo sound... how do I create it? how do I make it into a song?

These are the dilemmas we have... and I have a whole elaborate set of ideas on the topic, to keep it simply put... I believe that the twelve note scale is horribly inadequate for a musician who thinks in terms of a distorted saw signal run through a complex filter sweep and then through a digital delay that multiplies the original figuration of notes into something more amorphous and almost untranslatable into musical notation (because youd be having thousands of repitions, and it would take forever to notate that all)

The only great living composer in my opinion is Gyorgy Ligeti, and he had electronic instruments back in the late 50's and early 60's... and he felt that they were inadequate... and when you look at the RCA Mark II... you gotta admit... its got nothing on a violin for tone. He dealt with these questions of electronic versus acoustic instruments in such pieces as Lontano and the San Francisco Polyphony, in which he approaches musical sounds that rival the complexity possible in electronic music. I recommend a listen for anyone who is seriously interested in 20th century classical (the Ligeti Edition on Sony and the Ligeti Project on Teldec are marvelous recordings, and theyre existence is a real positive contribution to not only music, but human culture in general).

But to get to my point, Ligeti used acoustic instruments to get sounds he wanted to get with electronic instruments, but he couldnt do that back in 1961... hence he wrote Atmospheres (it was stolen by Stanley Kubrick without Ligeti's consent and used, along with the Dies Irae from his Requiem, on 2001 - A Space Odyssey). He used acoustics to mimic what electronic instruments can do now, like my Virus. Ive created several patches in which I imitate Ligeti's compositional techniques and I can pretty much improvise pieces which sound remarkabley like Lontano or the Requiem (except I lose the subtely of orchestrating 200 separate instrumental parts) But what I lose in the translation to my virus, I gain in ease of writing new music and not having to notate thousands of instruments doing what I can do by playing a few notes in succession.

This is where I believe electronic music should, and is, going. But I dont think that electronic music will be percieved as substative as opposed to 'canned' music, until we start performing on the instruments... and that is I guess the position I am coming from... I could write more on this, I have written more in my own files on it all... but I guess I'll leave my response with this question/observation?

Perhaps this is a better wayt to phrase my initial question; Im 23, are there any other kids out there thinking like me? I bought a new CD the other day, Frances the Mute, by the Mars Volta, they approach electronic / acoustic instruments in such a mind-blowing way, much akin to the way I approach my Virus... theres such a brilliant concentration of polyphonic ideas... its often bitonal (ie in two key signatures at once) and often goes into realms of electronic sounds that remind one of Gyorgy Ligeti mixed with Acid Jazz and Punk Rock... Anyways... thats enough I guess for now... looking forward to hearing others comments!
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Old 25.04.2005, 10:32 PM
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BlakeLight...for a 23 yr old...you've got a damn good head on yer shoulders

Interesting read......and original ideas....

DS
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Old 26.04.2005, 05:30 AM
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If I could actually play piano....I would probably play my Virus "live" as you say.....But alas.....my talents stop at basic major chords, and a couple minors.

I think we are definately entering some exciting, new times for music. I think we will see the return of concept albums, the 3:30 pop format will die in the ass and we will start to see 25min long monster songs (The Mars Volta are getting close...)

And then we will enter a new phase of psychadelia.......

It's comin'......I can feel it.

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Old 26.04.2005, 05:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jasedee
And then we will enter a new phase of psychadelia.......

It's comin'......I can feel it.

you still havent taken my advice to check out shpongle, have you jase

'are you shpongled' (199. most psychedelic electronic album of all time 8O

cheers

blay
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