marc wrote

well,
firstly it is a really great to have someone from access on this site.

what i meant was . it seems to me, a total computer layman who is not an apple mac user, but a PC pentium 4 user, that the updates to the OSX'S seem to be be quite substantial, and various things cant quite catch up, that quickly.

apple is endevouring to come up with a mega operating system, and from what i see really being visionary all the time.
. i have logic and will eventually change to apple :D , but i feel that i should just wait a little longer for all the things to be worked out and then i will make the change. (also very much a financial decision)
i asked access whether the software editor for TI would work for logic 5.5 and they said it would.
logic 5.5. is just fantastic and it was the cost that stopped me from changing in the first place after i had already purchaced a new PC and logic 5.5 just before the takeover.

that's good news.

in bad times it's nice to have a rich grandma ;-)

apple's intel cpu based macs will take a while and 10.4 was released about 6 weeks ago (?). i think you mixed the two things up. 104. is an update which works with the existing powermacs, not the future ones.

best, marc

I broke down yesterday... Canceled my preorder and bought a C for 1100 yesterday. No sleep this weekend! :)

enjoy mate. probably a smart move... :wink:

cheers

blay

Sounds like the upcoming U-He Zebra 2 is going to do wavetables too. Hmm...

you wouldnt be involved with the zebra 2 production team would you kuniklo? (I hope this isnt spam...)

have you used the z3ta?

cheers

blay

:)

No, just a fan of U-He's stuff. I like z3ta quite a bit too.

How can you be when you charge $2500 for a DSP chip and a keyboard? :roll:

8O

ouch...

cheers

blay

Cool. I'm definately keen to check out zebra 2 (now you mention it :wink:)

cheers

blay

It's what's on the chip(s) that count.

.... Number of man-hours in researching scientific sound-design and coding it in assembly language. That takes a lot of money.

If that was the case then independent developers of vsts/AU's would charge an arm and a leg too. I would think just as much R&D goes into the bigger name VSTi's. The going price for a decent vst is about 200-300 dollars. So lets do the math, $2500 - $300 = $2200. I stand corrected then.

$2200 for a DSP chip and keyboard. :wink:

Its the Uber Geek's time and the Uber Geek's Uber salaries you are paying for :lol: 8)

Overhead costs when manufacturing a product are very expensive, and the smaller the production run, the more it'll cost the consumer in the end. You have to consider tooling, assembly, painting/silk screening, labor, lighting, heat, and rent on the buildings in which to do these things; and this is still granting that the keybed, knobs, and switches are subcontracted. And you still haven't factored in a team of 3 or 4 R&D guys to develop the thing for two years, nor writing/print/press of the manual, nor the box and shipping materials. You still need QC and end-user support after that. Access could probably drop the price up to 10% and still stay afloat, but they most likely don't produce enough Viri to drop the price more than that. Sure, there are VA's out there for less, but there's a reason the Virus is the industry leader, and if they dropped the price too much, they'd have to cut too many corners on the manufacture side of things. I personally would be really surprised if they shipped more than 200,000 units.

Microsoft actually LOSES money on every Xbox they sell, the caveat for them is that they make it back from the game manufacturers who have to pay licensing fees for every copy of a game they sell. It costs a lot more than one would think to deliver a quality tech product, I'm just happy Access delivers a good one.

[quote="Panopticon"]Microsoft actually LOSES money on every Xbox they sellquote]

This is interesting! I dont doubt what you are saying, but would like to see that in writing.

I know the costs are high, I was just playing devils advocate of this whole thing. The thing is you dont come to a board like this and gloat about how you are not hurting for money and the ti will be done when it is done attitude. People are sweating and working their asses off to save money for their product and you sit here and throw it back in their face with a comment like that. Not very professional if you ask me! :cry:

Really? I just thought you were being plain rude.

Marc's comment was in direct response to the increasingly tiresome speculation that "Access is going the way of Waldorf". This can hardly be classified as 'gloating'. :roll:

I really can't see how Marc's post was rude. I'm one of the "people who's sweating and working their asses off to save money for their product" (I paid for the TI in december), but I really can't see (even when using my wildest imagination) how Marc's post was rude.

Of course this wait is a PITA, and Im checking their site for new information every damn day, but this situation doesn't make me "stupid".

This thread is staring to get nasty...... 8O

How about we be thankful that employees from Access actually visit this site and stop giving them a hard time.

Waiting for the Ti is not the end of the world, some people here really need to gain some perspective and stop whingeing about something that, in all reality, is not a big deal at all......Im sure it is a waste of time and energy, energy better spent making tunes, and embracing life with an open heart.

The Ti will come when the Ti comes......

:)

[quote="Merlot"]My apologies for this post. I was not having a good day and I probably should have not come to this board to vent. :oops:

Do you mean that Access will be putting in user wavetables just like Waldorf did? :D

Timo, we have a victory!!! Although I may have just misunderstood Ben's post. :wink:

Well I just go the recent turnkey catalogue in the mail...and of course it includes the virus TI range, which got me thinking that all these major music stores for months now have been advertising something in their catalogues that is not in stock, with no confirmed shipping date......this is firstly misleading and unfortunate from the perspective of the TI buyers especially those who have given ????$$$$deposits......

Secondly, being a bean counter (by trade), based on experience (product lifecycle) typically such product launch delays add up to increase costs for a company, which are either passed on to the customer or reduce the bottom line for the company.

Access must be hurting, in that I can only assume that these "unexpected" additional R&D/testing costs will definately be eating into their original profit margin. As the pricing was announced quite early on and I cannot (at least from marketing/reputational point of view) expect them to up the retail price..........It will be interesting to see what actually happens..Access can only hope that they sell more volume to compensate for the decreased profit margin.......

^ if Access want to increase volume of Virus sales....I personally think they should just tell everyone: The Virus TI is going to be their *last* Virus series synth. Access should then go into a new direction with FM, wavetable and PD technologies.....be nice to see these technologies brought back into the 21st century with decent user interfaces. Believe it or not...but no one has done this yet....

Access are obvously trying to make the ultimate VA....and all credit to them they are getting there....

DS

they will lift the price a bit

I doubt it.
If anything they should be offering some sort of 'bonus' to preorder customers for their patience...
Raising the price is not an option for Access.

cheers

blay

yes they will bonus the preorder guys and recoupe the loss from the new buyers

they are running a business :wink:

yep and thats why the rrp wont budge - unless Access has no integrity whatsoever.

cheers

blay

Yep, this could have probably been Access' last chance at a hardware synth, with all this huge wealth of computer synthesis booming at the mo giving it an even greater run for its money and maybe even surpassing it.

I would have preferred the TI to have done significantly more (in the way of sound warping (more hands-on controllers, ribbons, XY pads, etc.), sound-generation (yup, the wavetables are very welcome, but they're currently preset), and enhanced their current synthesis generation (like adding a fourth oscillator (or at the very least allowing the "sub" to become a fully functional oscillator in its own right, as opposed to being a very limited 'slave'); adding extra EGs (for pitch, or moreso modulating literally anything else that you fancy); more flexible LFOs (ie. so they're not each "fixed" to certain destinations); more emulated filters (like JP8, 303, OBXa, etc.); better saturation algorithms (as it currently suffocates the life out of most sounds, as opposed to warming them up like PSP Vintage Warmer or similar); maybe adding another filter type - a Peaking filter - to the current LP, HP, BP, BS line-up; allowing their third oscillator to have independent sync/ring-mod, FM controls to Oscillator 2; etc....

Physical modelling would be awesome, and I guess the Korg Oasys will cover this in time, including Wavetables (heavily updated from their wavestation), FM, and more.

I sincerely hope Korg release a synthesis 'workstation' successor to the Z1 at some point in the future, as I have absolutely no need for 70% of the Oasys (ie. the sequencer, the preset ROM samples, the weighted 76/88 piano keys, CD-RW, hard-drive, sample-RAM, Intel processor and custom-Linux OS, the 10.4 inch colour touchscreen, blah blah....)

PS > The Ti has been advertised in SOS in a dual-centrefold spread since around October/November last year, so pretty much all 100% of the customers must be a little disgruntled when they find it's still not been released yet.

Its not about integrity and what we believe is right. Its about what is financially viable to the company. If they have to raise the price....they will. Id recommend they dont. Maybe things in the UK are a little different...but...

Access have said that its their aim to introduce new virus flagship products at the same price as the one before...well lets just think about this..

The Virus KB was ?1229 when first introduced to the UK
The Virus KC was ?1329 then went to ?1349
The Virus TI lists at ?1499

DS

Obviously there has been a slight increase in cost with each range, but the difference isnt huge.

Access have shown the TI several times now since it was first announced in nov 04, and each time they have advised the same recommended retail price.

I just cant see them changing the price structure now - but hey, stranger things have happened. :roll:

cheers

blay

I love this thread! :D

Ahhhhhh..... *cracks open a virtual beer* :)

Anyone for a cookie?

I just ordered a KS4 for the moment instead of getting a TI Polar.

Too bad for Access, I believe I was one of the last remaining very few excited customers.

They screwed up really bad.

Im still excited, and I still have a pre-order :)

The wait is long and boring, I will stick tho :)

(oh im still making music and getting things done in the meantime, my life is not on hold :)

ten

Me too ten....I can see this going into 2006 :roll:

I suggest we find out where the TI's are stored, and rob the place!

Probably to find out there's no o.s. in them yet. :(

"....to save money for their product" (I paid for the TI in december), but I really...."

you already paid for the "virtual" Ti in december 2004?

now i know why access in not in financial troubles ;-)

That money would be in your supplier's bank acc - not with Access.

I suggest that your local supplier had a fine end of financial year party :wink:

f--k, sh--. this is all f.......g getting ridiculous.

I HAVE JUST NOTICED A ROUND BALD PATCH JUST START AT THE TOP OF MY HEAD. :evil: :evil: :evil: :x :x

my family said that it has started behind my back since i started going crazy about the TI not shipping.

has anyone else here suffered as much.

now i have to get lazer treatment, which will put th cost of the TI OVER 10000 DOLLARS AUD.

Shit! I just thought it was making my forehead grow 8O

cheers

blay